What are the fundamental differences between FIRMBss, Fitprime, & TLP workouts?

[isa]

Originally Posted by Debbie M

Hi there,

Aw, you know that I love passionate opinions, I would nver take your post as "You have to like them".

Fitprimes that I watched were "G-Force" and I think the other one was called "Weights First" (have to check the tape).

I´m glad you took it well !

Weights First is one of the first three Fitprimes, so that explains a lot. I don´t have G-Force, so I can´t say anything about it. I can see why the AWT concept won´t appeal to everyone (not enough strength and not enough cardio). For some people it works though .

My favourite Fitprimes are FTGU and Crunchtime. I think you wouldn´t like them either (for the reason mentioned above), allthough you´d find them less weird.

[Debbie M]

Originally Posted by isa

I´m glad you took it well !

Weights First is one of the first three Fitprimes, so that explains a lot. I don´t have G-Force, so I can´t say anything about it. I can see why the AWT concept won´t appeal to everyone (not enough strength and not enough cardio). For some people it works though .

My favourite Fitprimes are FTGU and Crunchtime. I think you wouldn´t like them either (for the reason mentioned above), allthough you´d find them less weird.

I generally like keeping it seperate but I love TLP (all 5 of them), Body Bar (who mix it up often), Mindy Mylrea, Cathe's Bootcamp, David Kirch's Bootcamp workout, Slim Series.....sure there are more that I can't call pure strength or pure cardio.

Rebounding is one thing that I just don't think mixes well with weight intervals. I just want to rebound! Yeah!!!!!

Deb

[Carol_is_fit]

GymRatt, I have all the TLP's and I really don't feel they're "weird" - just different. The core-focused moves take some time getting used to, but they really have helped me develop my core muscles! They don't use the tall box at all. A regular step is used, a stability ball, a med ball, and a short band that goes around the ankles only in Core Cardio. Weights are used as well, but I do believe nothing is higher than 10 pounds? They don't really say, but I know they aren't very heavy.

I had the first seven of the FitPrimes until I got tired of them. I liked some of the moves in them, but the editing was AWFUL and I couldn't deal with it anymore. My understanding is that Anna fixed those problems on the DVD's, but I can't say for sure since I don't have any of them.

Carol

[Liz N]

Debbie !

I'm still sifting my way through the Yorktowns. This is going to be one long review, however, I, on the whole, really like them. They are truly "functional" in every sense of the word and incorporate movements that are mimicked in every day life. There are terrific glute exercises in the Strength one. I love functional glute work.

I am also reviewing a couple of Charlene Pricketts for a couple of Vfers so look out for them as well!

I had a Firm Parts tape that I bought on Ebay for 2.00. Personally, I found the snippets of the Classic Firms scary in every way. I was intrigued because there has been so much talk about them.

I have got The Goodtimes Cardio Sculpt one with Jen Carmen, incidentally got it in a trade with a "Debbie" in Canada, but I'm sure it's not you! From memory, there are some things I liked in this workout, but thought it was too easy to be seriously taken as cardio.

I would love to review a Fitprime or two, so if you (or anyone else) would like to do a temporary loan, I am able and willing, though with the amount of tapes I have waiting to be reviewed it may take a few weeks.

[DawnP]

Originally Posted by GymRatt

That's interesting...what was the nature of the lawsuit?

I've pieced this together from bits & pieces that Mark Henriksen posted at MUM and FitPrime and from legal documents available on the web.

A FIRM employee, Everett Davis, was the "Director of Photography" on many of the original FIRM workouts. You can find his name on many of the video's credits.

He sued Anna, Mark & Cynthia to get royalties for his work on those videos beyond his current compensation when they began advertising & getting more distribution (profits). After many years apparently he lost his original case.

But he has a very aggressive (greedy?) lawyer (James Leslie Jr.?) who has repeatedly brought lawsuits against the three creators even after they closed the Charleston FIRM studio and sold the FIRM video production company to GoodTimes to recoup their losses and pay off their legal representation fees.

This employee & his lawyer were in court with the three creators as recently as September of this year with a suit against them & Meridian Films, so it's likely that he is continuing to threaten the original FIRM founders as they continue on their new WFN venture... possibly for a portion of their royalties due to the similarities between WFN/FitPrime and the FIRM.

You can see one of the legal documents showing a jury case convening in Richland SC in Sept: http://www.richlandonline.com/depart...os20040913.pdf

Too bad... especially if this delays any of the new WFN workouts...

[GymRatt]

Thanks, Dawn! Sounds like a soap opera!

[Debbie M]

Originally Posted by Liz N

Debbie !

I'm still sifting my way through the Yorktowns. This is going to be one long review, however, I, on the whole, really like them. They are truly "functional" in every sense of the word and incorporate movements that are mimicked in every day life. There are terrific glute exercises in the Strength one. I love functional glute work.

I am also reviewing a couple of Charlene Pricketts for a couple of Vfers so look out for them as well!

I had a Firm Parts tape that I bought on Ebay for 2.00. Personally, I found the snippets of the Classic Firms scary in every way. I was intrigued because there has been so much talk about them.

I have got The Goodtimes Cardio Sculpt one with Jen Carmen, incidentally got it in a trade with a "Debbie" in Canada, but I'm sure it's not you! From memory, there are some things I liked in this workout, but thought it was too easy to be seriously taken as cardio.

I would love to review a Fitprime or two, so if you (or anyone else) would like to do a temporary loan, I am able and willing, though with the amount of tapes I have waiting to be reviewed it may take a few weeks.

No pressure Liz! It sounds like you have many requested from VFers.

The connection between Benson Firm/Post-Benson Firm/Benson Fitprime/ Tracie Long Productions is so interconnected to be quite interesting. I imagine that is why this thread was started!

I have never seen a "new" Firm, so, no, I was not the Debbie in Canada. LOL

I thought every Benson Firm I ever tried was "scary in every way" as you put it! I unfortunately went overboard when I first came to VF and bought 14 Firm tapes at once! Needless to say, I no longer own any of them. I did make a nice sum of $ and a great trade for my Cardio Step Mix and Bootcamp as they had become collectors items after the Firm sale to Goodtimes!

I am glad that you like the Yorktowns. I am very surprised at my love of TLP. I did not expect to like them as much as I do because of my bad experience with the Firm. Tracie has always been very involved in her projects and designed many of the Firm and Fitprime workouts with Anna Benson. I guess I thought that if too much of that influence was brought to TLP, I would not like it. But, I think Tracie and the girls she has teamed up with have created a niche of their own that stands apart from Fitprime and The Firm. It seems more intentional and truly functional if that makes any sense.

My favorite TLP is probably still Core Foundations, even though the production is more polished in the Yorktowns.

I don't have a real Fitprime workout. My copy is an illegal copy taped just for me to get an idea if I would like them. The tape quality is not good either because there are 6 hours of workouts packed onto the tape!

If you ever get time, it would be great to see a review of an original Firm, a new Firm and a Fitprime. They would have to be chosen carefully to make sure the workouts were somewhat comparable. Since you have BSS Cardio Sculpt, a similar Fitprime and original Firm could be sent by an interested VFer or two.

But, you sound like you are up to your eyeballs with reviews anyway....so it is not an official request!

Deb

[isa]

I would say Fitprime Mix and Match dvd with Crunchtime and FTGU is the best choice. There´s footage of Anna Benson on that dvd as well.

[LCC]

Originally Posted by Liz N

I am also reviewing a couple of Charlene Pricketts for a couple of Vfers so look out for them as well!

I had a Firm Parts tape that I bought on Ebay for 2.00. Personally, I found the snippets of the Classic Firms scary in every way. I was intrigued because there has been so much talk about them.

I have got The Goodtimes Cardio Sculpt one with Jen Carmen, incidentally got it in a trade with a "Debbie" in Canada, but I'm sure it's not you! From memory, there are some things I liked in this workout, but thought it was too easy to be seriously taken as cardio.

Hi Liz,

Which Charlene's are you looking at? If you've never done any of her workouts, I would be interested to see the reviews.

Firm Parts...scary? LOL! The production values and clothes are kind of odd, but Standing Legs and Upper Body parts are still killers.

I don't think there is a Cardio Sculpt with Jen. Her BSS1 workout was Body Sculpt and her BSS2 workout was Total Sculpt & Abs. BS was pretty much a strength workout and TS&A was more of an old fashioned "tortoise" workout (75% strength/25% cardio). Maybe you have Cardio Sculpt with Allie? Jen is in the background on that one.

Back to the original question on Firm/Fitprime/TLP:

I think the new Firms are great...more athletic, less weirdish than the old Firms.

BSS1: Cardio Sculpt is good, but not super hard. Body Sculpt is pretty good.
BSS2: I love this set. They are all winners.
6 Pack: I love these too. The floor lower body 2 is probably the weakest of the bunch, but still good on a light day.
BSS3: These are actually pretty hard, if you can keep up with the incline aerobics. Still not bad without the incline aerobics. The background is kind of dark in these, but you don't notice it so much while you are sweating. (Well, the yoga workout doesn't do much for me.)

Fitprimes really are kind of strange. The one person in a corner production values aren't something I could look at everyday. But, the music tends to be pretty good. As to the workouts themselves:

Weights First: Production values are awful and the workout is bound to be uneven for everyone but the most Amazonian of us, since you do all of your left leg work first, then the right. I'm too tired to get the right done well by the time she's killed the left.

Core First: Okay workout. I kind of like that you get the floor work out of the way first.

Up & Down: I never go past about 35 minutes on this one. I like the instructor, but for me the workout is nicely over when you go back to the floor and complete the original workout cycle.

Strong Bear: A tough body workout and one of the two real winners in this bunch to me.

Fast Cheetah: I got weirded out and never finished this one. The bump your butt on the box move just pushed it over the top of the weirdness meter for me.

Crunch Time: I've never given this one a fair shot. I just don't enjoy the compound exercises for some reason.

Floor Burn: Haven't done it.

Steamin' Cardio: Haven't done it. I'll have to soon I guess. The claustrophobic set just really gets to me in a cardio workout more than the others for some reason.

From the Ground Up: The big winner in the bunch. But, Heidi must have gotten paid extra for every time she said the word "toes". Could get on your nerves. (And, you don't have to do it barefoot.)

G-Force: The only rebounder workout I really loved.

I never bought Anna's set.

On TLPs:
I have the Core workout and there are parts of that I will probably never be able to do. This also suffers from the claustrophobic set problem, but the workout is tough.

I have the Yorktowns and I think I've only done the cardio one. It was interesting, but I don't love it.

But then, I just don't love functional stuff as a general rule.

Boy, am I long winded today.

Laura (LCC)

[suebella]

...that someone would implant a chip in my brain that forced me to love functional fitness.

I have a couple of TLPs and, intellectually, I can see how they would develop core strength and increase ROM. I've done them a couple of times and - eh - I just don't love them. Or even like them.

I did a P90X rotation last summer and one of the workouts, Core Synergistics, is very similar to the TLPs. I had CS in rotation for 14 weeks, and at the end I could definitely feel and see a difference in core strength. I hated doing it, though, and haven't pullled it out since.

But this thread isn't about me, is it? HA!

I think the TLPs are all about function (and therefore, results) and the FitPrimes are all about form (and aethestics) and the FIRMs really pushed AWT as the end all and be all.