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Old 05-25-15, 02:36 PM  
Nuggie's Auntie
 
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Originally Posted by LynnO View Post
We shouldn't be witch hunting people or ruining their lives over small mistakes, especially those done pre adulthood. However, people who use such lies as marketing should definitely be exposed. That is the act of a conman, not someone who has moved beyond an indiscretion.
Yes, I have a lot of grace for those who do dumb stuff and own it and seek forgiveness, especially if the dumb stuff was done when young.

But this is a weird situation... there is a very strange pathology at work here. I cannot understand why anyone whose military experience was lived out so horrendously and ended so ignominiously would choose to evoke it years later for personal gain! It's pitiful, really. Something is very wrong with him.
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Old 05-25-15, 06:29 PM  
Messe
 
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Originally Posted by athompson10 View Post
(*sigh*) So the apology is not 100% honest, in that he says he did not 'perpetuate' the claim/lie but he certainly did....this wasn't the marketing team from 15 years ago but him, personally, 4 years ago hawking his KB system.

C'mon, guy.
This.

He lied, and the only reason he half-apologized is that he was found out. Even then, the half-apology was dishonest.
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Old 05-26-15, 05:23 AM  
Debbie S.
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Originally Posted by at120 View Post
The SEALS, like most of the special forces units, are a brotherhood that goes deeper beyond that of a simple fraternity. The rigors of training and later, the hazards of their missions, bond these individuals together to a level that is often closer than most family members share with each other. These guys take great pride in their accomplishments, so it's not a surprise for both active and retired service members to look so negatively at Skogg, especially since he has co-opted their reputation for financial gains. In fact, he's probably liable under the Stolen Valor Act for some sort of criminal penalty, since the guy has used his supposed SEAL and "ex special forces trainer" reputation in his marketing.
This is the point in this whole matter. The SEALS, along with the other speical ops in other military branches are the elite, and becoming part of the elite you have to be the best. He lied and he will have to face the consequences.
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Old 05-26-15, 05:25 AM  
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Originally Posted by Messe View Post
This.

He lied, and the only reason he half-apologized is that he was found out. Even then, the half-apology was dishonest.
Agreed.

Lying about yourself to market something is bad. But about something that could be found out so easily smacks of pathology to me. (Or is it easy to find out? Is that stuff kept pretty secret?).

It's something he's perpetuated for years and up until very recently. If it had been done once 20 years ago and then dropped/backtracked, that's one thing. The fact that it has been part of the marketing campaign for years is another to me.

But this, together with the assholery and criminal activity he wrote about, speaks to character. And if that doesn't matter anymore, we are all doomed.
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Old 05-26-15, 06:25 AM  
Nuggie's Auntie
 
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I'm glad there are people out there who call out this sort of thing. It's not like some guy spinning a yarn in a bar in an attempt to pick up women, Skogg and some of these other people are treading on other's accomplishments and sacrifices for personal financial gain.
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Old 05-26-15, 07:03 AM  
eam531
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Originally Posted by bearcatfan View Post

<snip>

Lying about yourself to market something is bad. But about something that could be found out so easily smacks of pathology to me. (Or is it easy to find out? Is that stuff kept pretty secret?).

<snip>
There is an organization called VeriSEAL that has amassed a database of all legitimate SEALs from the 1940s to the present. From their website:

"VeriSEAL utilizes an exclusive proprietary database called SOFCHECK -- a compilation of VeriSEAL historical case files merged with the BUD/S database, which is a complete record of all graduates of Basic Underwater Demolition/SEAL (BUD/S) training from the 1940s to current graduating BUD/S classes compiled by the Naval Special Warfare Center. While the information contained in SOFCHECK is not classified, it is sensitive. VeriSEAL maintains appropriate security measures and restricts direct database access to authorized CTP personnel only.

Numerous federal, state and local government agencies and the general public have utilized VeriSEAL to obtain SEAL and other Special Operations Forces background verification. Approximately 95% of the subjects of verification requests are Navy SEAL or other SOF impostors.

All inquiries are strictly confidential."

Skoggs was a teenager when the events he describes in his blog post happened. According to research, people's brains don't fully mature until around age 25. This doesn't excuse his actions then, but it just shows that teenagers can engage in very impulsive and destructive actions that they wouldn't dream of doing later in life. However, we have seen that Skoggs was still perpetuating his "I was in Special Ops!" myth as recently as 2011 in communications to people on VF, when he definitely was NOT a teenager. He may be a knowledgable kettlebell instructor but he has major problems with personal integrity.
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Old 05-26-15, 09:13 AM  
Demeris
 
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Originally Posted by Taiga View Post
I've used his programs on a very limited basis and can't claim any kind of particular fondness. But I can relate to human foibles.

It could take a while for the whole truth to surface, but honestly if his story pans out I'm glad he's out from under it. I hope the people who respond to his apology think very hard on their own skeletons. Imagine what it would be like to have your darkest secrets/embarrassments paraded. Sometimes you hope so much for time and distance to heal your mistakes. Maybe he finally built something in his life that had meaning and just didn't want it jeopardized by bad decisions made long ago.

I don't feel shocked when these kind of things surface. I assume that people are out there making mistakes and shooting an exercise video certainly doesn't exempt you from human frailty. I actually feel more irritated by instructors who don't do their fitness job well (Ellen's "Skinny is the new wealthy" comes to mind, blech) because that seems to be a more reasonable assessment for a fitness instructor.
Well stated. He's made a number of horrifyingly bad choices. His apology seems sincere, and I can only imagine the humility it took to come clean. You're right, of course, that it will take time for the whole story to surface.
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Old 05-26-15, 09:20 AM  
PhyllisG
 
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The only reason he came clean is because he got caught.
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Old 05-26-15, 10:00 AM  
Jags
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
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The thing about lies and the liars that tell them is that it immediately makes you wonder what else are they lying about? (TV newsman/anchor Brian Williams comes to mind.)

In the letter to VF-ers in January 2011 (link is posted upthread) Skogg's states:

"I've been training with kettlebells for 20+ years."
"I'm simply the best."

On these two counts alone stalwarts in the kettlebell industry would certainly balk. Pavel started in the US in 1998.

In the 2009 blurb, attached to the Weider interview of Skoggs posted on Youtube, it states:

"Michael is a coach and trainer who has been working in the fitness industry for 15 years. He was the owner and operator of Inner Strength, LLC, a very successful rehabilitation and conditioning center, specializing in sports related injuries. Michael was in the U.S. Special Forces stationed in the U.K. where kettlebell training was a mainstay of their conditioning regimen. He has continued to use this method to train a vast array of clients and professional athletes alike. 15+ years later kettlebell training is still the foundation to his healthy lifestyle which he enthusiastically shares with his clients."

If he never served in US Special Ops, he never trained in the UK with Kettlebells, and thereby I sincerely question the 20+ years claim.
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Old 05-26-15, 11:45 AM  
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Originally Posted by Eibhinn View Post

I've also always found it weird when past military experience is used to market fitness routines.
The military community (like any other community) is pretty close. We help, support and we lean on each other. So yes, using his military past in marketing makes sense because it will raise that feeling of 'support for those in you community' among other military people who are interested in his types of workouts. I'm not just talking about those who have served either, I'm talking about their families, friends and those who care about them in any way.

It's particularly painful to hear someone telling these sorts of lies if your
loved one didn't make it back. Someone who didn't even face the risks is going to take accolades for something others have died for?

To understand the feelings of betrayal some feel, just think of some group or community you are very involved in. Something you are passionate about. Then imagine someone comes along making claims of grandeur as something special in that community, then down the road you found out it was all a lie.

Not only does it insult the actual community you are a part of, but it also insults the members of that community.

As far as his apology, only he knows if it is sincere or not. I am trying not to judge because who hasn't told a lie? I mean really. I do believe when someone confesses and tries to fix things it is only fair to give them that chance.

I can't help but think that if he really didn't want this lie to get out, he should have just fessed up when his marketing team first said they wanted to use that angle.

I have really enjoyed his workouts and he is 'THE' kettlebell instructor I trust. Right now though, I don't think I could stand the sight of him. Those feelings will most likely change down the road.

So for me, apology accepted, but I will break from doing his workouts for a while.
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